[OccupySheffield] Open Source classifiers list M15 Global Long Term Strike proposals

Mon Jan 9 00:57:29 GMT 2012

Hello
regarding the list type craiglist.com but with a sustainable market
information (as i explained to you with information of sustanaible
companies, inventors, ecology food and products, available lands, open
sources machines....etc )  that we could develop by the Open Source working
groups for the different countries. I have found that there are models of
Open source  classifiers web sites, that n-1 developers and here in N.Y
could work on that and make it making public for the people who would like
to add data to thouse classifications.

*http://classified-ads-software.blogspot.com/
http://php.resourceindex.com/Complete_Scripts/Classified_Ads/
http://www.iclassified.info/*

check this out: http://www.ted.com/talks/marcin_jakubowski.html
May i ask you who can i contact with from n-1 to talk about this?
bestnikky

On Thu, Dec 29, 2011 at 11:17 PM, Orsan Senalp <orsan1234 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks Mark for this, very interesting article. as you might me aware I
> have been thinking and working on such social network union[ism] idea, and
> trying to implement it with gaia [experiment],
>
> this was the original experiemnt http://openfsm.net/projects/gaia/summary
> now it is moved to here
> https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/943821/global-alliance-for-immediate-alteration-gaia/
>
>
> Besides my limited capacity and lack of real participation to it the rise
> of global indignados made it secondary experiemnt,
>
> Now it may be a good time to collectively activate it and transform this
> experiment into a truly horizontal p2p project. Actually, the rising of the
> arab spring, 15M and occupy movement have created a great chance to do this.
>
> So. I would like to make a concrete proposal and hope everybody reads and
> welcomes it:
>
> Reading you message i think it is time to bring labour-realted occupants
> and intesrested activists to build such transnational networked union from
> the basis in a horizntal way based on concensus and assebly principles and
> on individual peerage. [even these principles needs to be collectively
> thought of course]
>
> That's why I would like to suggest creation of such a new
> commons/grassroots/renakandfile/wiki union, as an agenda topic for the
> neext IRC meeting on global strike. If we can proceed then I think ir can
> be easer to think and act collectively in the lead to european and global
> stirke projects for occupy alternatives.
> such new labour self organisation from the bottom would make a very big
> and positive transformatory impact on the existing union structures, i
> believe, while providing self alternative for billions of unprotected
> employed or unemployed, working people.
>
> in solidarity!
>
> Orsan
>
>
>
> 2011/12/29 Mark Barrett <marknbarrett at googlemail.com>
>
>> hey neb, nicky,orsan, niel and everyone!
>>
>> not sure if it fits but your post about a new labor movement reminded
>> me of a discussion some of us are having in the uk about the need for
>> a new union, or union network, or some such for unemployed and diverse
>> other ('dis-abled', for example being a problematic formulation)
>> workers.
>>
>> what aims such a union/network might hold would obviously be subject
>> to horizontal formulation, but some ideas are mentioned on the other
>> thread, just posted on titled 'voice of the voiceless 21st jan
>> sheffield uk - unemployed / other diverse workers union ?'
>>
>> some of us privately liked the idea of a campaign for the "right to a
>> living wage and opportunities for meaningful, liberating, well-paid
>> work for all" for example. would be great to link this kind of
>> thinking to the european mobilisations being planned for the spring
>> because europe, like usa but with the added impetus of its
>> constitutional crisis, desperately needs a new labor movement that
>> fits the needs of the 21st century...
>>
>> [ and personally i think that something along these lines could revive
>> employment and social productivity but towards a community-based,
>> ecologically and politically sound ( ie democratic and emancipatory )
>> economy, hence an article,  ( admittedly sketchy  ;)  written back in
>> july
>> http://righttowork.org.uk/2011/07/real-democracy-and-the-future-of-work/
>>  ]
>>
>> i hope this helps!!
>>
>> love and solidarity
>>
>> mark
>> sent to squares international communication platform cc/ sheffield-uk
>> national email list, london international commission, oh15
>>
>> On 29 December 2011 07:57, Neb <Neb at occupywallst.org> wrote:
>> > Excellent idea. I was writing something a very similar tactic way back
>> > in August so I'll need to find the file to share so you can take some
>> > of the ideas I had. America needs a new labor movement and this would
>> > be a great foundation to get the ball rolling. If our small affinity
>> > group can prop up Occupy we should be able to prop this up as well.
>> > Our bureaucratic unions in America are worthless so a wikistrike won't
>> > affect America that much so we need to incorporate other tactics as
>> > well besides striking. Building a new labor movement from ground up is
>> > going to be a real challenge in America especially in our prolonged
>> > recession but I think it can be done.
>> >
>> > We'll need to get in touch with our allies in Europe again very soon
>> > if we are serious. After the New Years it's time to get the ball
>> > rolling again and start something bigger than Occupy. That'll give us
>> > five months to agitate, organize and educate compared to measly two
>> > months we had.
>> > Any advice from Europe?
>> >
>> > Thanks and solidarity.
>> > _______________________________________________
>> >
>> nikky schiller
>> 05:55 (3 hours ago)
>> to squares
>>
>>
>> This message may not have been sent by: nikkyschiller at gmail.com  Learn
>> more  Report phishingHello everyone,
>> i apologize i haven´t been able to be at the meeting yesterday, I had
>> appoiment with the hospital and working with global revolution takes
>> my whole time...
>> But i would like to keep talking and proposing ideas that i have been
>> thinking about this " strike" , or named in another name that means
>> "stop working for the corrupt system to organize ourselves in a better
>> way".
>> I think that to be successful in this project, we would need to make a
>> big database of all the entities that could form a pararell and fair
>> market to start working in  the consecution of a market which wants to
>> distribute the wealth to all the people around the world without
>> iniquity.
>> I give you an example of  the format like
>> http://www.craigslist.org/about/sites/     where you can find by all
>> around the world many different resources.
>> We could add to this kind of list:  cooperatives, sustainable
>> companies, farmers, inventors, solidarity banks, barters, classifieds,
>> ecologic products, free patents,... so the people could have this
>> information in their hands and could make a election about their
>> choice of consume. The newspapers, tv channels , radio stations of
>> this movement could promote this information, so we could channel the
>> consume to get a healthier and optimal consume for the whole
>> community.
>> In another hand, regarding the minimun services that should not
>> stopped by the security of the health of the people, i think that it
>> could be a good exercise of sharing  comradership and solidarity to
>> maket all needed services being covered by the Community.
>> In Sol square, we created a small selfsufficient  world with all
>> public services covered, it was a good example of what our world in a
>> big scale can make self -sufficient if all the Community is involved.
>> I look forward your comments, and ideas to improve proposal.
>> best
>> Nikky
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 23, 2011 at 12:04 PM, Orsan Senalp <orsan1234 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Same time same place this evening? sorry that i could not respond the
>> below emails, i had to sell my labour last two weeks, and felt luck to
>> be able to do so! this have to change, we need to be able to provide a
>> very clear vision of an alternative much better life, so people do not
>> support idiotic fascist programs just becasue that need to feel
>> secure. Let me post here below again the WIkiStike idea so Manuel and
>> others we can try to think of a positive, productive, creative, and
>> impactful new generation stirke that can combine the power of
>> knowledge workers+precariat+proleteriat and indigenous people. Here is
>> the short idea for a WikiStrike: Thanks Anna for the modification!
>>
>>
>> What is WikiStrike!
>> WikiStrike is an open ended and open to all form of strike different
>> from traditional methods used mainly by unionised workers and aimed at
>> improving working conditions and living standards by changing the
>> behaviour of the employer or political ruler.
>> In addition to using the power we have in terms of the production
>> process, with WikiStrikes we utilize the power coming from
>> hyper-connectivity and the collective hyper intelligence/creativity we
>> posses today in order to protect life, justice and peace -be it at
>> local, national or international level.
>> All forces of social change can join in the global WikiStrike process
>> and work in a collaborative way to achieve these objectives.
>> Arab Revolutionaries, Spanish Indignados and Global Occupiers have
>> proven that the WikiStrike is not only an idea, it is both possible
>> and effective.
>> ----------------------
>> We are withnessing the rise of new generation stirkes that are
>> organised as swarm like direct actions and combining the power ceoming
>> from production with the power coming from
>> communication/hyperconnectivity. These new generation strikes are
>> often harmonises many kind of direct actions in a positive, assertive,
>> productive and creative framework. This open framework can be named as
>> WikiStrike.
>> In terms of public services good example can be the provision of free
>> services to the public, or reaprepriation of the stolen private
>> information of the consumers and workers by large companies. autoreter
>> and brutaity state posture, and general offensive towards democratic
>> and social rights will be the overarching theme. basic income and less
>> working hours too will be leading themes I think, as well as free
>> ulture, information, anti-war, anti violent as well.
>> On this page we ar egoing to investigate and develop this new
>> poweerful tool of the self-organised working man.
>>
>>
>> https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/964050/world-wide-wikistrike/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------
>> another think is about the date dicussion, as some others I also don't
>> care the exact date. It is important though to have a warm climate and
>> good spring mode and total consensus among the asesemblies, so the
>> peoples involved,
>> 12 May, 15 May have been two good candidates,  We needed to decide
>> fast but also be careful not to hurry, so collectivity and consensus
>> get ignored, this is the most important thig. I think in this sense it
>> has been a good intention and initiative but a mistake to launch 12
>> May without wider consesus provided.
>> The idea as i got it was to spread it and seek for wider consesus at
>> the first place. we need to talk about this this evening?
>> another thing I could not communicate before on the strike and date
>> meetings was our avoidance from the 1st May, becasue may be we are
>> assuming that it blongs to the uninon movement!  if so it is wrong. In
>> the Netherlands and several european countries it is not even
>> celebrated by the union movemetn. It symbolises the fight for 8 hour
>> work day and other rights won by the indignados, of the time. So
>> instead of leaving that date out, to unions, we need to reclaim it I
>> believe. That can be a key to link up with the rank and file union
>> members. and promote such new generation mass strikes, that can put
>> pressure on the elite globally, not in the west of in the east alone.
>> hope we can talk with wider participation this evening. and i would
>> like to suggest using mumble and irc at the same time so we can write
>> down the minutes and be able to express ourselves by words at the same
>> time!..
>>
>>
>> In solidairty!
>> Orsan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2011/12/21 Manuel <manuel at whiteflag.info>
>>
>> It might be that, as Michelle - chessypig- saysis day  and Anna
>> before, I have not
>>
>> understood the meaning of the action due to the name strike - hit. I might
>> have missed some points, and if I did not actively support then the call
>> for
>> an strike same reason; its name. So, as you are in a hurry, maybe It is no
>> point that I get into your ???? (we can talk about it another day)  but
>> just
>> your concrete question as per below for courtesy sake
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: squares-bounces at lists.takethesquare.net
>> [mailto:squares-bounces at lists.takethesquare.net] On Behalf Of
>> niel at squat.net
>>
>> Sent: miércoles, 21 de diciembre de 2011 16:19
>> To: squares at lists.takethesquare.net
>> Subject: Re: [Squares] M15 Global Long Term Strike
>>
>> I'm totally in disagreament with a large part of your mail so I dont know
>> how to start because I donẗ have a lot of time right now to enter in
>> this clarifications.
>> > When you pushed forwards your call for a global strike (probably with
>> > much less support than the call to the 12th) in the squares meeting
>> > long ago, I said I do not agree, but I would not oppose (and so you
>> > got it against other people opposition).
>> You was against for a strike and you was alone, chessypig was against
>> during
>> all the debate but changed his mind at the end of the meeting and we found
>> consensus, but all the other participants was for, not just a general
>> strike, but especially this kind of new strike (transition strike, 2.0,
>> call
>> it a you want)
>>
>> > I understand that historically left wing and progressive thinking has
>> > confronted state deception to his own people with the same coin;
>> > irrationality, call it dialectic and in this way has actually obtained
>> > some achievements (when the West was the whole world). And this is
>> > what a strike means,
>> ???
>>
>>  but, in my understanding, a strike will have a mixed effect (it
>> > could
>> > be good effect, but I sincerely think rather bad, it might put the
>> > whole under risk. A global long term strike????) therefore I did not
>> agree.
>> ??? can you explain risk??? I will understand why you did not agree.
>>
>>
>> My meaning of risk means to put in danger the whole movement in an
>> inappropriate action
>>
>>
>> The
>> > way for the state to defuse those initiatives is to oppose other civil
>> > people who comply with their duties, but the state itself will not get
>> > involved in any dialectic which put itself into question). Now, as we
>> > discussed in the meeting that day, we shall not follow the old
>> > patterns anymore, the reason why state leaders have to deceive their
>> > people and concentrate more and more resources in the 1% is to keep
>> > the 99% in precarious condition and make them obey and in this way the
>> > state is competitive (but this richness concentration is not because
>> > the state want a few people living very well, as many think, or
>> > because the state cannot avoid it) but as a consequence of the always
>> > ongoing cold or warm war in the world as ever war (even if cold) is
>> > the real business of the state, this is human tragedy, and this is
>> > what we have to face now and consider as most important of all to
>> > change the world.
>> We dont talk about the same thing I think
>>
>>
>> Maybe, I doubt now, I thought of a usual strike as I said above
>>
>>
>>
>> > Are the Indian, Chinese or Russian going on strike too on the 15M? I
>> > do not think so. Therefore the strike is to put pressure only in the
>> > West.
>> You dont think? We have the contacts and they are in this same
>> (r)evolution
>> look what is happening in this three countries.
>>
>>
>> Ok, great
>>
>>
>> > And, on the other side, what is the meaning of the 12th, I myself
>> support?
>> > It is a call for the real internationalization of the movement, and
>> > this internationalization goes first to an vanguard of young people,
>> > maybe students, with internet and world connections. Etc. You see, it
>> > is different target, therefore I do not oppose the 15M, as this is
>> > also an international call and I could see it in the line, but first
>> > is communication, then is action, and, unless the states do, we can
>> > communicate now using common sense. Only this could be human hope, and
>> > this is REALITY NOW.
>> Are you talking about 15Oct? Because the things are different now.
>>
>> Ok, fine. I am not so sure yet, but surely we can advance.
>>
>>
>> > It is about communication, it is about information, because for the
>> > first time in history we are not doomed to irrationality as in the
>> > past. It is now for the first time, as we are global, or, at less, we
>> > want to become global, that we can  put in place common sense and
>> > advance from it together, and our target is no to make a strike of
>> > some, but to make a call for the world to work together.
>> If they work together a lot of them will stop to work for the actual
>> institutions and business, can we call this a strike?
>>
>>
>> Ok, got your point.
>> Just now I remember that I wrote it to defend the actions on the 12th you
>> opposed as per below and from this my arguments started. I do not really
>> want to discuss put brakes to your initiative or any other and wished the
>> same for the one related to the 12thM.
>>
>>
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: squares-bounces at lists.takethesquare.net
>> > [mailto:squares-bounces at lists.takethesquare.net] On Behalf Of
>> > niel at squat.net
>> > Sent: miércoles, 21 de diciembre de 2011 2:02
>> > To: squares at lists.takethesquare.net
>> > Cc: Anna Harris; Dr. TR. Rojas-D
>> > Subject: [Squares] M15 Global Long Term Strike
>> >
>> > Nikky, we will not be coherent the 12, a little bit more the 15 but we
>> > will start to be efficient only if we maintain the fight after the 15.
>> > If you go to meet the workers you have to bring them something new,
>> > not another demonstration for a saturday. They want the same then us,
>> > and they are also fade up with the unions mp, the politicians, the law
>> > and all the institutions.
>> >
>> > We have now the infrastructure and experience to permit (strike
>> > kitchens, strike houses, strike funds...) and organize (space for
>> > meeting, spokes councils, workshops...)  the long duration strike. The
>> > people who want to do it will do it with our support, the same for the
>> > people who want just one day strike, but the same also for the people
>> > who can just demonstrate the 12. We are all the 99% in a same fight,
>> > so how to go in the same direction to support each other?
>> >
>> > Well if the people in DRY are just organizing another 15O for the 12,
>> > sorry I will not be in. A lot of people see the next global day as a
>> > start for an unstoppable process of transition, where we will moving
>> > forward:
>> > intensify and coordinate direct actions (sabotages, embargo, strikes...
>> > with more actors of the society) for one part, intensify and
>> > coordinate alternatives projects (socials, economics, ecologic... with
>> > more services for the society) for another.
>> > Both helping each other because this is what we are, a non stop
>> > protest thinking the future.
>> > We have to know what we are doing: I mean what we are and what we want.
>> >
>> > We are communities (camps, squats, eco-villages, cooperatives,
>> > autonomous zones, self-managed places...) divided in cooperatives
>> > (groups of people working on common projects)  but all coordinated by
>> > a GA (horizontal, transparent, open to everybody, looking for
>> > consensus...) That´s our practice of the real democracy.
>> >
>> > We want a real democracy (that the actual institutions work how we
>> > practice the real direct democracy, or create new ones) so we pressure
>> > for one part the actual institutions (police, universities,
>> > parliaments, banks, media...) with direct actions --> and the long
>> > term strike is the most coherent but we also create a maximum of
>> > communities and cooperatives (working
>> > groups) coordinated by the same GA --> and the concept of holistic
>> > cooperative is the most coherent.
>> >
>> > Our goal is not to make the most attractive community but to create
>> > and coordinate a maximum of different cooperatives, everyday more self
>> > managed and self-sufficients.
>> > And it´s not to make a big march all together every six month like the
>> > unions, but to make that a maximum of people start to coordinate
>> actions.
>> >
>> > We have today the power (knowledge, contacts, technology,
>> > opportunity...) to reinvent the strike but also to reinvent the world.
>> > The farmers instead of burning their food in front of their
>> > distributers will feed the people in long term strike, action with an
>> > useful double effect and we have to organize this. We can also
>> > organize grouped buying or exchanges social currencies and services
>> > with this producers to include new useful products/services inside the
>> > cooperative. And try to feed neighborhoods, workers, communities in
>> > sustainable projects. But also you instead of cleaning your camp
>> > tomorrow, go to clean your neighborhood, show that this kind of
>> > cooperatives will be possible in a higher level after the 15, if not,
>> your
>> camp serve to nothing.
>> > Instead of organizing a conference on economy in the university tent,
>> > organize one year classes of economy with other outraged professor and
>> > economists directly on your campus, or just a platform of preparation
>> > for the exams until the end of the year.
>> > Instead of stopping your public transport, maintain a free transport
>> > for your communities, your workers, your neighborhood...
>> >
>> > Well I really think that it´s the logical road to this peaceful
>> > (r)evolution we all look for and because it´s possible, everyday more
>> > people are working on it :) But the most important is to know that
>> > this is our direction, not only the
>> > 12 or the 15, because if we don´t know a total success the 15 we need
>> > this work to help us for the 16, and for the 17... This is just the
>> beginning!
>> > Seguimos adelante.
>> >
>> > (What do you think about the title of the thread?)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Please send this kind of messages in squares list with (15M Global
>> >> Strike)
>> >> that can help more people to understand you.
>> >>
>> >> The workers who take the street just one day are reformists, they ask
>> >> to the state or their institution or their boss to listen their
>> >> voices and to change in reaction. We are talking about peaceful
>> >> revolutions, did you ever seen that in one day?
>> >> The reformists just can be agree with this option to continue the
>> >> fight, it´s the best option to pressure the institution you want to
>> >> reform so the consensus is easy.
>> >> We have to focus on the same objective if we are a global movement
>> >> and it´s easy to know that few things are consensuated in this
>> >> movement, we want a real democracy now, we work on, and as a movement
>> >> we extend and connect them because we all agree that our methodology
>> >> of assembly/consensus is the way to organize us (policy, economy,
>> >> property...). For this some of us want to reform institutions and
>> >> other want to create new ones, own ones but we all want a global
>> >> change. So the most radical have to present a concrete alternative
>> >> and the most reformists have to radicalize their modes of action. And
>> >> it looks like the both are going in this direction.
>> >> The first objective of a responsible member of direct action is to
>> >> make that a maximum of people do direct actions, before doing actions
>> >> with is own affinity group, and outreach will help bringing unions
>> >> mp, workers, farmers, students to the spokes council to organize
>> >> concrete coordinated actions on 15M, AFTER AND BEFORE.
>> >> I think that it´s better to separate outreach ¨labor¨ and outreach
>> >> ¨community¨ who work to THE OBJECTIVE of the movement: start, improve
>> >> and connect communities funccioning with this real democracy in a
>> >> maximum of spaces and sectors of the society, it´s also the best work
>> >> to provide real alternatives (economic, ecologic, industrials...) to
>> >> maintain the fight on 15M, AFTER AND BEFORE.
>> >> Press have to start to communicate on it (better with manual and
>> >> concrete
>> >> plans) and international have to stay connected with the global
>> project.
>> >> I have more specified informations by cities/working groups/people at
>> >> a local or global level and we can talk about it on skype:
>> >> ci-syntagma, I´m also working in a general video but it can be large
>> >> and take time...
>> >> In London or in Barcelona, the people works for the 15M global
>> >> strike, since I arrived everybody is talking about it, and the only
>> >> one argument to organize a global day the 12 is for the people who
>> >> cannot strike the 15, but people who support the 15, and as I said
>> >> before the best way to support this day is to open a big platform of
>> >> mobilization for the 15 during the 12 like re-taking the squares as
>> >> the american and spanish want to do.
>> >>
>> >>> Global Strike May 2012 is not a strike in the way it is usually
>> >>> meant of withdrawing labour in order to pressure bosses for increase
>> >>> in wages or better working conditions. What we are proposing is a
>> >>> continuous strike, a permanent withdrawal from the current system
>> >>> and switching to an alternative one. In order to make this feasible,
>> >>> the alternative system needs to be up and running by May next year.
>> >>> Outrageous! Impossible!
>> >>> Yes.
>> >>> I
>> >>> agree with you. Nevertheless it has to happen if we are serious
>> >>> about moving from this morally bankrupt and physically damaging path
>> >>> we are on, to a sustainable system that puts people before profit.
>> >>>
>> >>> We need to become aware of our part in maintaining the system.
>> >>> Everytime
>> >>> we
>> >>> use money to make a transaction, but more than that, actually our
>> >>> whole culture is predicated on the system continuing. We are trapped
>> >>> in it and though we know it is leading to our self-destruction, we
>> >>> cannot get out of it, EXCEPT by creating the alternative. We are
>> >>> putting our energy into demos, protests, sit-ins, temporary strikes
>> >>> of 1 day or 3 days, which are supposed to gather momentum, spread
>> >>> the word, show our power to the 1%, and at the same time we are
>> >>> totally comitted to maintaining the system in our daily lives, a
>> >>> system which separates us and disempowers us. If our energies were
>> >>> concentrating on developing a system that serves the people, not in
>> >>> theory, but in actuality we would overcome our isolation and empower
>> >>> ourselves. Very much as Transition Towns have been doing.
>> >>> GlobalStrike 2012 is not a call to get masses out on the streets, it
>> >>> is a clarion call to stop colluding with the system, while at the
>> >>> same time trying to fight it. That schizophrenia has to be replaced
>> >>> by the singular intention of withdrawing from the present morally
>> >>> bankrupt and physically damaging system, and together building a new
>> >>> one.
>> >>> Maybe you want to know what it is going to be like – this new
>> >>> system- before you commit yourself. Sorry, the commitment comes
>> >>> first. That’s asking a lot. Yes, it is asking for everything you
>> >>> got. Remember what is at stake here is the possibility of the
>> >>> continuation of human existence.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> n-1 working group:
>> https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/104127/take-the-square-international/
>>
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>>
>>
>
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>
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