[OccupySheffield] [Occupy London] Re: [INT] Fwd: [Squares] MAYDAY! MAYDAY!

Mon Jan 2 01:47:11 GMT 2012

I'm not sure that I'm on the occupy sheffield list, but I think this will reach you Dawn. (By the way, thanks for your mail).

I had a conversation about this at St. Paul's.  I moved to London (for family reasons) after 15 years in Glastonbury.  That community, like Hebden Bridge, Stroud and a few other places have some very good sustainable things going but, and its a big but, they don't address the issue for the majority of people, most of whom live in cities and large towns.  It's a huge subject, and it's immensely frustrating that what is being built is still being built to terrible standards, that although there is plenty of land people can't live on it, never mind grow organic crops on it etc. etc.

I also agree with you about website.  It needs to be really simple and accessible.  There is quite a divide between people who spend loads of time online, and love all the new possibilities: skype, mumble, and so on, and those of us who just want to share ideas with each other, without bells and whistles. !

I want to get on with stuff and spend less, not more, time online.

Liz

On 2 Jan 2012, at 01:32, barriers2bridges at virginmedia.com wrote:

> Why not bring a workshop to the conference here in Sheffield?
> Also, could you set up a ‘straitforward website, which would be more accessible than f/b or twitter?
>  
> Dawn
>  
> From: Mark Barrett [mailto:marknbarrett at googlemail.com] 
> Sent: 02 January 2012 00:09
> Cc: occupylondon at groupspaces.com; occupysheffield at email-lists.org
> Subject: Re: [OccupySheffield] [Occupy London] Re: [INT] Fwd: [Squares] MAYDAY! MAYDAY!
>  
> Heather and others, about your desire for more lobbying..
>  
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Lobby OLSX <lobbyolsx at gmail.com>
> Date: 30 December 2011 02:09
> Subject: hey, link up any thoughts :)
> To: crdlondon at gmail.com
> 
> hello,
> 
> I sent an email detailing direct democracy action for J10 in the form
> of lobbying methods and building a general lobbying policy and
> initiative in london.
> 
> the group is occupy london lobbying - I have set up a twitter acc and
> FB pages but am looking for more support to run workshops for
> democracy and assemblies that can be run on the theme of individual
> effort in a collective consciousness.
> 
> Thanks, please email me for more info, be pleased to hear any thoughts. :)
> Danny
> 
> On 2 January 2012 00:04, barriers2bridges at virginmedia.com <barriers2bridges at virginmedia.com> wrote:
> I agree, but to be fare, the eco systems you describe are pretty few and far between, at least in the west and yeah, exist within a little utopia.
> Even within the UK they are pretty insular against a backdrop of capitalist domination.  For example, Hockerton Housing Project (which I read about for a paper I had to write for my course last year) exists because it gives people the choice to 'live green and adopt a kinder/gentler lifestyle - not because living off-grid is a necessity the way it might be in say South American countries.
> Yeah, I personally would like to visit there, as its somewhere near Nottingham and not too far from Sheffield - they do group and individual tours and talks.
> Also, it was the only one that provided the example that, they strived to be accessible for people with special needs - many of them just don't and a lot of people, join them, stay a few years and then move on if their romantic ideals of a greener nirvana haven't risen to their expectations - I've experienced it for myself; they also can be extremely uninvighting to "outsiders" especially if they think you pose a threat...
> 
> The eco/sustainable communities we need to build upon, must be out of necessity, not out of some ideology that is seemingly out-of-reach to those not middle-class enough to be able to invest in shared land, for example.
> I also think Heeley farm are providing a good exsample of an urban-based set of sustainable practices, both addressing the environment and marginalised communities; they support community allotments - some within deprived areas, some particularly for under 5's, who might not get exposed to such a thing.
> Still, its far too small scale, just like the 'small scale' investment in say solar or wind power.
> Lets face it, the UK doesn't even support vehicles going over to veg fat or dung to replace gas or deasle.
> Its mad, but these are what we must be pushing any capitalist government to adopt and fast, rather than pandering to trans-national corporations, holding entire governments to ransom.  Why isn't anyone pushing the UK and European governments to snub the IMF?
> These are the things we've absolutely got to lobby, otherwise, the powers-that-be will just continue to turn their noses up to a bunch of people sleeping in tents in public spaces and not 'really doing much else'...!!!!
> 
>  Dawn      
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: niel at squat.net [mailto:niel at squat.net] Sent: 01 January 2012 15:57
> To: LondonInternationalCommission at groupspaces.com
> Cc: occupylondon at groupspaces.com; occupysheffield at email-lists.org
> Subject: Re: [OccupySheffield] [Occupy London] Re: [INT] Fwd: [Squares] MAYDAY! MAYDAY!
> 
> The alternative, non-exploitative modes of value-creation already exist
> George, I don't know in a big capitalist city like London but in north of
> Spain, south of France or north of Italy you can find a lot of autonomous
> communities, eco-industries, organic farms, alternatives currencies and
> bank of time, holistic cooperatives...
> And in south America, central America, India, in the pacific, we don't
> need to build an economic reality alternative to the dominant system from
> zero, the challenge as you said is to link this initiatives, at least to
> share the knowledge but also the resources if possible.
> I have a lot of friends who give up the fight because they already live in
> their utopia, they don't need to camp or fight everyday, they don't need
> us but we need them.
> A lot of people in 'Occupy' movement say that they are anti-capitalists
> but I don't see/listen/read them investigating about the post-capitalist
> projects/world... Protesting is easy, the challenge now is to be/live
> coherent with our fight.
> 
> 
> you raise an important point George!
> Sent from phone
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "George Por" <george at community-intelligence.com>
> Sender: OccupyLondon at groupspaces.com
> Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 10:51:46
> To: jamie kelsey-fry<lsxcamp at gmail.com>;
> <LondonInternationalCommission at groupspaces.com>
> Reply-To: george at community-intelligence.com
> Cc: occupylondon at groupspaces.com<OccupyLondon at groupspaces.com>;
> <occupysheffield at email-lists.org>; <oh15 at googlegroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Occupy London] Re: [INT] Fwd: [Squares] MAYDAY! MAYDAY!
> 
> Hmm... continuous strike? how will the 99% make a living without the
> alternative, non-exploitative modes of value-creation being in place?
> 
> Call outs are easy; building an economic reality alternative to the
> dominant
> system is challenging! Yet what is challenging appeals me more than what
> is
> easy...
> 
> george
> 
> Wow
> 
> I am with that Mayday call out 100%.Â
> "a continuous strike, a permanent
> withdrawal from the current system, a signal for all those who feel
> their work to be meaningless and unsatisfying, to switch to
> alternative means which are beneficial to the whole community, to
> support themselves and their families"
> 
> To me, this is the profound escalation that the movement needs.
> Brilliant.
> 
> Between now and May, there is enough time to make this happen as long as
> it
> becomes the focus globally very soon. Definitely something for
> Sheffield?
> 
> Best
> 
> JamieÂ Â
> On Sat, Dec 31, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Mark Barrett
> <marknbarrett at googlemail.com>
> wrote:
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> MAYDAY! MAYDAY!
> It is obvious we are headed for disaster unless we change course
> drastically, and we don't have a lot of time. A project is being
> discussed internationally in the Occupy movement - Global Strike May
> 2012. What we are proposing is a continuous strike, a permanent
> withdrawal from the current system, a signal for all those who feel
> their work to be meaningless and unsatisfying, to switch to
> alternative means which are beneficial to the whole community, to
> support themselves and their families. In order to make this feasible
> this alternative system needs to be up and running by May 2012.
> Outrageous! Impossible! I agree with you. Nevertheless it has to
> happen if we are serious about moving from this morally bankrupt and
> physically damaging path we are on, to a sustainable system that puts
> people before profit. Join us on Take the Squares Network
> https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/1010883/15m-global-strike/
> <https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/1010883/15m-global-strike/> . and please
> pass
> around to friends
> and colleagues.
> ______________________________________________
> 
> n-1 working group:
> https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/104127/take-the-square-international/
> <https://n-1.cc/pg/groups/104127/take-the-square-international/>
> 
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> 
> 
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> 
> -- 
> Apathy is Dead ! http://www.flickr.com/photos/solarider/5254770064/#/photos/solarider/5254770064/lightbox/
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> 
> Friendly reminder: please keep these mailing list discussions to a minimum as they reach a lot of people. Instead you can email working groups and individuals directly, or use the Occupy London forum at occupylondon . info
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